4 thoughts on “Watch “[DEBUNKED] Did Jesus Predict His Own Death? A Historical Problem for Islam” on YouTube

  1. Vaqas Rehman

    I wonder what historians like say Bart Erhman think about the whole Jesus(a.s) predicting his own death thing? Granted i’m sure a good chunk throw it out do not believing in miracles and the like but still a good perspective to have in this discussion.

    Liked by 1 person

    1. mr.heathcliff

      “I wonder what historians like say Bart Erhman think about the whole Jesus(a.s) predicting his own death thing? Granted i’m sure a good chunk throw it out do not believing in miracles and the like but still a good perspective to have in this discussion.”

      any prophet who thought that they were being targeted for death could have thought they would get cornered and die. until Allah reassured them that they would not and He would rescue them . i think ehrman believes that the prediction is from later christians, not from jesus. he said to me that later christians would have actually if memory is correct, i asked him on his blog and he thinks jesus did not predict his death

      out of curiosity has paul said that ot predicted the death of messiah or that his jesus made predictions about his death? if you look at “earliest creed”
      “prophecy of death of messiah” = not found.

      apologists like craig, nt write , say that prediction is not from the mouth of jesus. they need this to be the case because then one could argue that jesus’ close followers were in on the “plan”

      i leave you with two quotes

      Have you counted jesus predictions of his death in each gospel starting with mark, then Matthew, luke and John? I think you will find that the number of predictions increased and also start to begin sooner in his ministry, very soon indeed in the fourth gospel john, with the baptist in the first chapter declaring jesus to be the lamb of god, a sacrificial lamb. Mark has no such early prediction. Let me know what you find when you study the gospels in the chronological order I suggested. The tell me how you see the story growing over time.

      and

      Williams wants to defend the expectations that Jesus would rise from the dead, arguing Jesus likely told his followers to expect it and even hostile Jews would be concerned about a claim of it (pp. 239-40), evidently not realizing this increases the probability of hallucinating or dreaming a confirmation of it…or even indeed of stealing a body to inspire it; after all, Jesus repeatedly telling them the plan, sounds an awful lot like a plan; which is why William Lane Craig likes to deny Jesus predicted his resurrection (see my discussion of the plausibility of theft in Ch. 9 of The Empty Tomb). This does not help his case. But his argument suffers from a number of unjustifiable assumptions anyway, such as that Matthew’s addition to Mark of a wild tale of monster-paralyzed guards has anything to do with reality. In the original version, there is no knowledge or expectation Jesus’s followers would claim he rose from the dead; nor any plausibility to tales of Jesus telling them he would—which portray his Jewish followers as not even knowing what a resurrection was, nor ever understanding or believing him, which is odd behavior for fanatical cultists.

      Liked by 1 person

    2. mr.heathcliff

      there is a crosstian apologist who calls himself “inspiring philosophy”

      even he denies jesus predicted his death and ress

      quote :

      Yet we are told Jesus told them all about it. He repeatedly told them what was going to happen: (John 2:18-22), (Matthew 12:39-40) (Matthew 16:21, (John 10:17, 18).In fact, such predictions were so well known that Pilate was asked to secure the tomb ((Matthew 27:62-64) Are you saying they thought Jesus was talking out of his ….deleted word? Why would they doubt this miracle working savior, who routinely demonstrated who he was?

      ip

      None of those predictions are historical.

      https://old.reddit.com/r/AcademicBiblical/comments/flhpzs/did_james_convert_to_christianity_and_was_it/

      croosstian apologists need those predictions to be invented to support craigs minimal “facts”

      Liked by 1 person

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